Altec 417 8H Series II Speakers

That elusive piece of the overall equation, so many options and so little time to test them all — Celestion, Fane, Eminence, Jensen, JbL, Utah, Ceramic, Alnico, 1x12, 2x12, 4x12, 2x10, 4x10, 1x15, 2x15, 4x15, 1x18 and I'm sure there are even more!

Altec 417 8H Series II Speakers

Postby Mmusicmann on Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:00 am

Does anyone remember Altec 417 8H Series II Musical Instrument Speakers (12" 8 ohm)? They are widely known as the "Santana sound" speaker which I recall he used with his Boogies. I used them in the '80s (I'd always used JBLs in the '70s).

I've seen wanted ads where people were seeking them to use in their Marshall cabs. I just saw two sell on eBay for $250 ea. So apparently they are still sought after.

I bought two of them new in 1989 that I never used. I recently pulled them out of storage and decided to break 'em in. So far I've hooked them to a Peavey 100 watt head, a Mesa Boogie 50 watt, and my old 1977 Musicman HD-130 head. They really are good sounding speakers.

I'm interested in knowing more about them. How sought after are they, if much at all? Any particular applications? Who uses them? Etc. Just for curiosity's sake. I'm sort of a history buff.

Best regards,
Mmusicmann
Peasant
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:01 am

re

Postby DreamTone7 on Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:42 pm

Although Santana used those at some point, Abraxas (when he first started using his Boogie) came out long before those speakers were available (which was sometime in the late 70's I believe). Santana used the 417-8B in his first Boogie. The 8A, 8B and 8C had paper formers for the voice coil...they sounded sweeter but could handle less power (about 75 watts). The 8H models could handle upwards of 100 watts, but used fiberglass formers that gave it a harder sound. It's the 8H models that Randy Rhodes used in his Marshall cabs back in the day. That sound is all over Ozzy's first two solo albums.

All that said, they don't demand nearly the price that the D-120F's (with original cones) do.
He that hath an ear, let him hear.
User avatar
DreamTone7
Baron
 
Posts: 2465
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2002 8:01 am
Location: Tacoma, WA

Re: re

Postby Mmusicmann on Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:39 pm

DreamTone7 wrote:Although Santana used those at some point, Abraxas (when he first started using his Boogie) came out long before those speakers were available (which was sometime in the late 70's I believe). Santana used the 417-8B in his first Boogie. The 8A, 8B and 8C had paper formers for the voice coil...they sounded sweeter but could handle less power (about 75 watts). The 8H models could handle upwards of 100 watts, but used fiberglass formers that gave it a harder sound. It's the 8H models that Randy Rhodes used in his Marshall cabs back in the day. That sound is all over Ozzy's first two solo albums.

All that said, they don't demand nearly the price that the D-120F's (with original cones) do.


Seems I remember these JBLs of Twin fame. And yes, the Rhodes connection makes sense. These are speakers for those who want to get loud. In my old age I tend to prefer low watt Greens so I don't have to melt my ears to get to break up. But these Altecs are indeed sweet to the ear nonethelsss. Thanks for the comments.

Best regards,
Mmusicmann
Peasant
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:01 am

Postby pckpat on Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:47 am

i never realized carlos used boogies on that album :o i just assumed it was fender combos(probably because of the woodstock footage)he sure had some smokin tone back then,for sure.
User avatar
pckpat
Emperor
 
Posts: 7546
Joined: Sun Jan 12, 2003 8:01 am
Location: lower canuckistan

Postby methodofcontrol on Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:58 am

don't forget the original Boogie's were just hot-rodded fenders!

417-8h: i used to have 4 of them in my traynor cab. too bright for my marshalls, but DEVASTATING with my ampeg V4 and mesa boogie SOB.
HUGE sound out of those. i sold the speakers only because i was afraid that if i blew one i'd have to pay too much to replace it. i originally scored the altec loaded traynor cab for $75 back in '00 or '01. sold the speakers as a quad about 2 years later for $850 or so. still have the cab. aside from me missing those speakers (sonically only. i certainly don't miss the weight!) that was a good day! ;)
methodofcontrol
Knight
 
Posts: 1497
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 7:01 am
Location: location, location

Re: re

Postby DreamTone7 on Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:30 pm

Mmusicmann wrote:
DreamTone7 wrote:Although Santana used those at some point, Abraxas (when he first started using his Boogie) came out long before those speakers were available (which was sometime in the late 70's I believe). Santana used the 417-8B in his first Boogie. The 8A, 8B and 8C had paper formers for the voice coil...they sounded sweeter but could handle less power (about 75 watts). The 8H models could handle upwards of 100 watts, but used fiberglass formers that gave it a harder sound. It's the 8H models that Randy Rhodes used in his Marshall cabs back in the day. That sound is all over Ozzy's first two solo albums.

All that said, they don't demand nearly the price that the D-120F's (with original cones) do.


Seems I remember these JBLs of Twin fame. And yes, the Rhodes connection makes sense. These are speakers for those who want to get loud. In my old age I tend to prefer low watt Greens so I don't have to melt my ears to get to break up. But these Altecs are indeed sweet to the ear nonethelsss. Thanks for the comments.

Best regards,


NP...the reason I mention the JBL is because, in those days, Boogie offered four diff speakers in their amps. The Altec, the JBL, the EV and something else (can't remember). The EV was the basic stock speaker offered, but for a little extra you could get the Altec, the JBL or ? The JBL absolutely kills in a Boogie for clean or slightly overdriven tones...but if you wanted to push it, the Altec was the way to go.
He that hath an ear, let him hear.
User avatar
DreamTone7
Baron
 
Posts: 2465
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2002 8:01 am
Location: Tacoma, WA

Postby MajorWatt on Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:17 pm

To me, the Altecs and EV's have mids the JBL's don't. I tried a mix of two 417's and two V30's in a Marshall cab, and it was crunch city. :lol:
Check out our songs at.......
http://www.youtube.com/my_videos?feature=mhee
http://www.reverbnation.com/blacksundaydream
http://www.soundclick.com/blacksundaydream
Image

"Except For Ending Slavery, Fascism, Nazism and Communism, WAR has Never Solved Anything."
User avatar
MajorWatt
Airport Gropee
 
Posts: 13835
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 8:01 am
Location: S.F. Bay Area. Where the sun always shines! Except on cloudy or rainy days...

Re: re

Postby conchmariner on Wed Feb 27, 2008 8:00 pm

DreamTone7 wrote:Although Santana used those at some point, Abraxas (when he first started using his Boogie) came out long before those speakers were available (which was sometime in the late 70's I believe). Santana used the 417-8B in his first Boogie. The 8A, 8B and 8C had paper formers for the voice coil...they sounded sweeter but could handle less power (about 75 watts). The 8H models could handle upwards of 100 watts, but used fiberglass formers that gave it a harder sound. It's the 8H models that Randy Rhodes used in his Marshall cabs back in the day. That sound is all over Ozzy's first two solo albums.

All that said, they don't demand nearly the price that the D-120F's (with original cones) do.


I bought some two 417s in 1973 at Ace Music in Miami. Originally had them in an Ampeg VT-22 but put them in a closed back no name cab which I still have after putting JBL D-120Fs in the Ampeg which I sadly no longer have. I still hve the receipt for the speakers somewhere so I have to check whether 8A or 8B. I'd actually thought they were 8Hs, but if they weren't available until the late 70's, then I guess that's not the case. I'm primarily using that cab with a blonde 6G6B Bassman.
conchmariner
Squire
 
Posts: 999
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:59 pm

re

Postby DreamTone7 on Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:51 pm

Image
Altec 417-8B

Image
Altec 417-8C

Image
Altec 417-8H Series II

Visuals can make ID easier. Notice the curved supports on the 8B...the 8A was very similar. That changed with the 8C, with angled supports more like the D-120F. Then we got the H that had the larger, extended magnet cover on the back.

Seems the 8H came out in the early 70's and the 8H Series II in the mid 70's. FWIW, I've seen pics of the back of Santana's original Boogie where you can see that the speaker had the curved supports...so it was not an 8C or 8H...though I know he used the 8H in the late 70's. I've also read somewhere that it was an 8B in his original Boogie which, based on the photos I saw, makes sense.
He that hath an ear, let him hear.
User avatar
DreamTone7
Baron
 
Posts: 2465
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2002 8:01 am
Location: Tacoma, WA

Postby pckpat on Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:24 am

wow- those altec pix are gettin me to droolin- :lol: i remember goin to a santana/john mc laughlin concert(around the love supreme album time)mahavishnu had a marshall full stack, while carlos was wailin thru a princeton and an echoplex setup- i thought that was so cool 8) :lol:
User avatar
pckpat
Emperor
 
Posts: 7546
Joined: Sun Jan 12, 2003 8:01 am
Location: lower canuckistan

Re: re

Postby OldSchoolDave on Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:38 am

DreamTone7 wrote:Visuals can make ID easier.


THANKS for posting those pics! I couldn't remember which Altecs I installed in my Twin, back in '73.

Now, I can say definitively, they were 8C's.

Dave
...Hey! I played that song when it was new...
.
http://www.OldSchoolDave.com
User avatar
OldSchoolDave
Prince
 
Posts: 3583
Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: West of the Arch, MO

Postby methodofcontrol on Fri Feb 29, 2008 3:45 am

here's some more images for you to drool over. catalog style!
scroll your mouse over the image and you can blow it up.

http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/a ... page04.jpg

http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/a ... page07.jpg
methodofcontrol
Knight
 
Posts: 1497
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 7:01 am
Location: location, location

Re: re

Postby conchmariner on Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:08 pm

OldSchoolDave wrote:
DreamTone7 wrote:Visuals can make ID easier.


THANKS for posting those pics! I couldn't remember which Altecs I installed in my Twin, back in '73.

Now, I can say definitively, they were 8C's.

Dave


Yes, thank you indeed. Looking at those pics makes me pretty sure mine are 8Cs as well.
conchmariner
Squire
 
Posts: 999
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:59 pm

Postby MajorWatt on Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:52 pm

I peeked at mine again and the four 8 ohm speakers are "B" models while the four 16 ohms are "C" models.
Check out our songs at.......
http://www.youtube.com/my_videos?feature=mhee
http://www.reverbnation.com/blacksundaydream
http://www.soundclick.com/blacksundaydream
Image

"Except For Ending Slavery, Fascism, Nazism and Communism, WAR has Never Solved Anything."
User avatar
MajorWatt
Airport Gropee
 
Posts: 13835
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 8:01 am
Location: S.F. Bay Area. Where the sun always shines! Except on cloudy or rainy days...

re

Postby DreamTone7 on Fri Feb 29, 2008 6:10 pm

MajorWatt wrote:I peeked at mine again and the four 8 ohm speakers are "B" models while the four 16 ohms are "C" models.


IIRC, Altec made a lot of 16-ohm C models (labelled "Type 417 Diacone") for Ampeg 4X12 cabs. They did a lot of special order stuff when it made sense (ie, there were a lot to make), but the stock speaker for all models was 8-ohm. Other oddball 16-ohm models were sometimes referred to as "417-16C" or 417-16H" and so on.
He that hath an ear, let him hear.
User avatar
DreamTone7
Baron
 
Posts: 2465
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2002 8:01 am
Location: Tacoma, WA

Next

Return to Speakers and Cabinets

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests